Our Finnish friend at Opax-flyfishing pointed us towards this interesting article on Sexyloops about the true costs of graphite fly rods.
Steve Parton is a well-known English custom builder (and iconoclast) who dives into the numbers behind graphite fly rods.
What’s interesting is his take on the domestic (in this case the UK) vs Chinese-made rods:
In the UK any manufacturer can knock out excellent 2 piece 10′ blanks for £15:00p at base cost. And if you understand Production you will not be surprised to realise that to make a sensible profit and pay for the plant, capital and expertise the base price gets tripled so that blank will get sold on at around £45:00p.
Any more than that and somebody is pulling somebody else’s leg rather - or costs are catastrophically out of control -
which can and does happen and then they wonder why they went bankrupt! You can cut the cost of blanks in two ways - if you buy a lot or make a lot the same then there are some production economies and the more you buy the
cheaper they will get.The other way of cutting the costs is to proceed to the Far East where the poor sods work for a lot less and when I tell you that I can buy perfectly adequate 10′ AFTM 7/8, 2 and 3 piece fully finished flyrods for just less than £5:00p each from China you will understand just how deadly is cheap labour competition these days.
Take a 1,000 set and the blanks I can buy for less than £2:50p - and if I specify the finishes in a corrupt forger’s manner and spend an extra £1:00p per unit I will willingly bet you couldn’t tell the things from most American or European Manufacturing Sources - which is why most of what you think is American or European Made isn’t at
all.
Interesting. We have labeling laws in the USA which make it pretty clear which rods are built here and which are not.
Still, it’s clear why Sage, Winston and a few others have chosen to offshore production of their lower-end fly rods. (As far as I know, Scott is the only major US company who manufactures their entire line in the USA.)
Where it gets interesting isn’t at the bottom of the fly rod food chain - where pricing models force overseas production - but at the top.
Are $600-$700 graphite fly rods truly defensible given their mass-produced nature?
Given my understanding of free market economics, if the rods are being bought, then yes, the price is wholly defensible.
Subtract the costs of distribution (the retailer nearly doubles the price to stay in business, the manufacturer’s rep takes a cut, they gotta be shipped, etc), and a manufacturer’s marketing costs (most are still pursuing standard one-way media buys despite falling ROI), and you quickly discover what’s left.
Which is usually less than you thought. Then figure in the costs of those largely ridiculous warranties.
Still, is it too much, or too little? The Underground is yours…
[tags]fly rod, graphite fly rod[/tags]
{ 7 comments… read them below or add one }
flytimes 01.08.07 at 10:54 am
I’ve recently paid $40 “handling fees” to Sage and Winston respectively. I figure shipping is $10 call it $15 for the sake of argument and the factory is left with $25 in their pocket. Seems to me that they are doing well. I know it sounds naive but I think that the manufacurer should eat the cost of the warranty.
Wyatt
Ian 01.08.07 at 1:27 pm
I’ve personaly benefited at least as much if not more than anyone out there from rod warranties. However, it does come to mind that the only other product I can think of with a similar warranty is a Craftsman wrench. Also, you have to remember that someone is getting paid to turn the product around when you send it back. Seems to be it would be cheaper to pay a small fee for rod repair than pay a high built in fee front for a rod you don’t break. Regardless, you can be sure the manufacturer who stays in business will never eat the cost completely.
Will 01.08.07 at 2:24 pm
Correct me if I’m wrong, but another assumption of free market economics is that rational, informed decisions are being made on both sides of the transaction. So, if low-budget models are truly similar to more expensive ones (a subject about which I am completely clueless), then we can say the demand for the expensive models is artificially inflated by poor information.
kbarton10 01.08.07 at 3:07 pm
I guess I am going to have to wade in with the traditional “mean old codger” flavor. While the price of fly rods have climbed to nosebleed levels, have there really been in measurable advances in graphite rods since they debuted ?
The thread, fittings, cork, and reel seats all appear to be the same gear we have been using for some time. The fit and finish is also of similar quality as in the past.
So, like all other sport/hobbies, we have taken the path of “lets make the club exclusive because it costs too damn much to join” approach.
With care a good rod will last one or more lifetimes, but that is the exception rather than the rule. Car doors and dumb arsed nephews ensure we buy more than a single rod during our career afield.
A fine bamboo rod requiring many hours of hand work should cost an arm and a leg, but a graphite rod is made of carbon, in an operation almost entirely done by machine.
Methinks the juice is not worth the squeeze.
kbarton10 01.08.07 at 4:35 pm
“debuted” is something you wipe with after lowering the possum. I think I wanted to say “since their debut.”
My apologies for slaughtering the Queen’s English.
opax 01.09.07 at 12:23 am
>Given my understanding of free market economics, if the rods are being bought, then yes, the price is wholly defensible.
Well said.
Tom Chandler 01.09.07 at 10:58 am
The warranties are certainly a contentious issue. If you’re not a rod breaker, how much are you paying to protect those who are?
Instead of a “no-questions” warranty, I’d support paying a fee to repair a rod (rather than paying for two rods when I bought one). I understand that the new Orvis rods use a resin material that dramatically reduces breakage, though they seem to be selling it as a “performance” improvement.
Maybe that’s the real benefit of long-term warranties - they’re incentive for building rods that don’t break down in a stiff breeze.
As for whether today’s rods represent improvements in performance, I fall directly into kbarton’s “codger” category.
In terms of cost, durability and fishability, I get the distinct impression that s-glass fiberglass might be the best trout rod material ever made, though I might be pushed as far into the future as the introduction of IM6 graphite.
Bamboo’s great too, but kinda expensive.